I would love to install linux on all of our computers and run the same
xp vm on them all since all but two aren't connected to the internet.
One license for all computers would definitely violate the license and I
wouldn't blame MS for pursuing someone who did that because it just
makes sense. MS however, doesn't accept fair and sensible. Vista
licenses prohibit running vmware on Vista Home and prohibits Vista home
as a guest vm. Why? because they can.

Jim Margarit

Johnnie Norsworthy wrote:
> "Jon Lloyd Duerdoth" <jld@welshdragoncomputing.ca> wrote in message
> news:08482C23-EA9C-462F-90C7-52F7766CE5C7@news.elevatesoft.com...
>> I'm guessing that if you set up a VM with Windows XP
>> activated and then made duplicates of the VM that it would not require
>> further activation... probably violates the EULA tho'
>
> No, it did not require re-activation for subsequent VMs cloned from the
> first one. It probably violates the EULA, I have heard, so I would never,
> ever do that.
>
> -Johnnie
>
>

Hi,

> I'm guessing that if you set up a VM with Windows XP
> activated and then made duplicates of the VM that it would not require
> further activation... probably violates the EULA tho'

I haven't tried VMWare yet, but have used MS Virtual PC. You can move a
Virtual PC Windows XP from one computer to another (such as if you're
upgrading a PC, or restoring a backup after a crash on a new computer)
without any activation issues. However - the same does not apply for Vista.

I installed vista on VirtualPC on a spare desktop the other day, with the
thoughts of moving it to my main notebook when finished and activated. (I
was developing at the time, and didn't want the downltime on my notebook, so
it seemed like a good idea). The activation went fine on my spare PC, but as
soon as I moved it to my laptop - it detected the new machine, and wanted to
reactivate again.

I've got no idea whether this is the same with VMWare, but something to keep
in mind, because - as Ralph said - it may be great for restoring after a
fatal system crash onto a new box, but if you're running with vista, that
30mins may blow out if you need to get on the phone to Microsoft to do some
explaining for them to release the activation. (especially if it's after
hours on the weekend.)

As for making duplicates of VM voilating the EULA - wouldn't that be only if
you installed on multiple PC's? (ie, forgetting VMWare for a second - if I
installed 2 copies of Windows XP on the same computer, in a dual-boot
arrangement - is that allowable, or do I require 2 seperate licenses even
though it's on the same PC?)

Cheers

Adam.

Reading one of the forums at Microsoft it was stated quite clearly
that the license is for one installation not one machine... so
based upon that 2 licenses would be required.

Jon

Adam H. wrote:
> Hi,
>
>> I'm guessing that if you set up a VM with Windows XP
>> activated and then made duplicates of the VM that it would not require
>> further activation... probably violates the EULA tho'
>
> I haven't tried VMWare yet, but have used MS Virtual PC. You can move a
> Virtual PC Windows XP from one computer to another (such as if you're
> upgrading a PC, or restoring a backup after a crash on a new computer)
> without any activation issues. However - the same does not apply for Vista.
>
> I installed vista on VirtualPC on a spare desktop the other day, with the
> thoughts of moving it to my main notebook when finished and activated. (I
> was developing at the time, and didn't want the downltime on my notebook, so
> it seemed like a good idea). The activation went fine on my spare PC, but as
> soon as I moved it to my laptop - it detected the new machine, and wanted to
> reactivate again.
>
> I've got no idea whether this is the same with VMWare, but something to keep
> in mind, because - as Ralph said - it may be great for restoring after a
> fatal system crash onto a new box, but if you're running with vista, that
> 30mins may blow out if you need to get on the phone to Microsoft to do some
> explaining for them to release the activation. (especially if it's after
> hours on the weekend.)
>
> As for making duplicates of VM voilating the EULA - wouldn't that be only if
> you installed on multiple PC's? (ie, forgetting VMWare for a second - if I
> installed 2 copies of Windows XP on the same computer, in a dual-boot
> arrangement - is that allowable, or do I require 2 seperate licenses even
> though it's on the same PC?)
>
> Cheers
>
> Adam.
>
>

In article <CA643B48-43D2-4FB6-B335-A3099DCF2E23@news.elevatesoft.com>,
jln206@verizon.net (Johnnie Norsworthy) wrote:

> No, it did not require re-activation for subsequent VMs cloned from
> the first one. It probably violates the EULA, I have heard, so I
> would never, ever do that.
....naturally.
However...
just suppose you did a full VM XP installation (fully activated and
service packed etc) and created a snapshot. If you then based all your
working machines on that snapshot (NOT cloned) then you would only ever
be running one copy of XP on, technically, the same machine so you could
have different setups all with the same root snapshot.
....or so I've heard...

Alternatively get the MS Action Pack for £200 pa - gets you ten licenses
of the OS plus servers and MS Office too.

Steve

Jon Lloyd Duerdoth wrote:
> Fascinating thread!
>
> I've not even tried VMWare but it certainly sounds interesting.
>
> What about the issue of installing Windows multiple times in
> several VMs... do you get into activation issues with Microsoft?

I use Win2k for my "work" VMs (plus XP on a test VM). Being in a MSDN
program helps. But I am sure that Microsoft has to change their license
policy sooner than later because VMs become more popular every day. And
nobody wants to pay for 4 Vista licenses just to get a nice working
environment: one for the real hardware, one for internet access, one for
development and one for server stuff, like db servers.

Ralf

"Ralf Mimoun" <nospam@rad-on.de> wrote in message
news:798EFFDB-2D83-45E7-883C-21350D65BF03@news.elevatesoft.com...

> But I am sure that Microsoft has to change their license policy sooner
> than later because VMs become more popular every day.

<cough> <cough>

I don't think MS *has* to do anything, do they?  

However - I do agree with your concept. I think if Microsoft don't change
their policy, it won't make a huge difference in the end - it'll just mean
that they're pushing more end users into the 'illegal' category - because I
too can't see many paying 4 vista licenses for the one machine. (VMWare,
Dualboot, or otherwise).

However - as far as we're concerned (as developers), I agree with Steve. The
best way for us to remain legal in either situation is to get the Microsoft
Action Pack Subscription if you need multiple licenses. Has worked for me!

Adam.

Hi Steve,

> However...
> just suppose you did a full VM XP installation (fully activated and
> service packed etc) and created a snapshot. If you then based all your
> working machines on that snapshot (NOT cloned) then you would only ever
> be running one copy of XP on, technically, the same machine so you could
> have different setups all with the same root snapshot.
> ...or so I've heard...

That's what I was wondering about the licencing - whether that's
"acceptable" or not in Microsoft eye's.

I've done somethign similar in the past - but not quite the same:

1) Install and activate a Windows XP Virtual PC machine.

2) Make a copy of this - call it 'baseline', and whack it on a CD

3) Use my install for whatever I want. (Testing demo/shareware software,
etc, etc) until the machine gets too 'messy'

4) Delete that file in the end, and copy my baseline backup of CD again.
(Saves me reinstalling and reactivating each time I want to do a 'reformat',
and also saves me having to
reinstall)

This also works well when I upgrade my laptop, as I can simply move my
virtual machine across onto the new laptop.

However - the same does not work with Vista (in MS Virtual PC anyway) - as
when I tried moving it to my latest laptop not long ago after upgrading, it
detected it as a new machine, and wanted reactivating all over again. Not a
huge problem (as I don't upgrade notebooks *that* often), but I did find it
interesting that Microsoft have set up Vista (or Virtual PC) to detect
change of machines.

> Alternatively get the MS Action Pack for £200 pa - gets you ten licenses
> of the OS plus servers and MS Office too.

I've got that myself. I find I never get anywhere near the 10 licenses, even
with an extra copy of Virtual PC running, so I'm safe either way.

Cheers

Adam.

>  is to get the Microsoft
> Action Pack Subscription if you need multiple licenses.

MSDN OS subscription gets 10 too, and is probably more useful to
developers since it gives all OS's and not just the latest.

/Matthew Jones/

Adam H. wrote:
....
> I don't think MS *has* to do anything, do they?  

Please remember that I am not a native speaker They on't _have_ to, but
its possible that they will lose quite some market share when VMs hit the
mass market.

Ralf

Hi Ralf,

>> I don't think MS *has* to do anything, do they?  
>
> Please remember that I am not a native speaker

Sorry - completely forgot. Still - my post was more directed at a hit to
them, and not to you.

> They on't _have_ to, but its possible that they will lose quite some
> market share when VMs hit the mass market.

Out of curiosity - can someone give me a brief rundown on the benefits to
VM, as opposed to the free Virtual PC from Microsoft? (I know VM can run off
a linux OS, which Virtual PC can't - but is that it)?

Cheers

Adam.