Matthew

>Yes, I understand, but the expectation here is long term support of our
>customers. We have people who bought the software ten years ago asking
>for install codes, and we happily give them again.

I understand that you're looking for long term customers so make that first purchase as painless as possible. Even if the credit card is stolen asking for an email, sending a reply and then getting them to validate their email isn't going to stop fraud. It will add a valid email address to your database, unless they're like me and give false ones. If the customer has to wait around (the longest I've had is a couple of days) and you have a competitor selling the same stuff they may just go there.

You have to get their details when they pay for the stuff. Ask for the information then. Assume that if they've given you money and want you to have their email address it will be a valid one. They have to enter it twice so that "should" prevent typing it in wrong. Why not trust your customers?

You can probably tell I feel strongly about this can't you

>> > Not sure how easy postcode lookups would really be - is the database
>> > free now?
>>
>> Don't be silly.
>
>Well, it was a serious question. There is apparently an open database
>now, but it doesn't really help a lot for addresses. I can only find
>expensive services, and they would eat the money on our sales.

Yes, but you live in the UK, surely you're used to being ripped off by now? At the time of the Post Office sell off there was some discussion of who owned the post code database, but I can't remember the outcome.

Rather than buying the database I'm sure I seen an offering somewhere that you can throw a postcode to and it'll send you the info back on a pay per go basis.

<tongue in cheek>
If you only expect 50 new customers a day you could probably use http://www.royalmail.com/find-a-postcode
</tongue in cheek>

Roy Lambert

Matthew

>> You've managed to hit one of my pet hatreds - invoice download - then
>> display in browser.
>
>Well, most customers want a nicely formatted invoice, so PDF is what we
>give. How you choose to display it (or your browser does) is up to you!
>I guess we could mark it for saving in the return info...

I'm not complaining about the use of PDF but the fact that you use download as a shorthand for "display in browser"

>> Now I've managed to buy the stuff (how do I download the Ovalmaps
>> please?) the order isn't displayed when I visit the url. I still
>> would like to know where and how it is being stored in the event of
>> the transaction not completing.
>
>Due to the test mode, the ovalmap pads aren't actually shipped. 8-)

But you've just sent me an order confirmation

>Not sure which URL you are talking about though. Or order. Or are you
>talking about the cart contents - I've explained that. The cart is
>emptied on the completion info from the server, but left if it fails so
>you can try again.

Yup that was it.

I thought I'd give it a go in IE just to see. Without logging in added one of each to the cart, closed IE and then reopened. Still there. Now to reboot, and its still there.

It is limited to browser as you say. I opened your site in IE, Chrome, and Maxthon and the uncompleted order only exists in IE.

Next test was to power off the PC and restart - its still there - definitely persistent.

Same behaviour in Chrome - don't have FireFox or Opera.

If it means anything I'm running W7x64 Home Premium on this PC

Roy Lambert

Roy Lambert wrote:

>  Even if the credit card is stolen asking for an email, sending a
> reply and then getting them to validate their email isn't going to
> stop fraud.

It is expected that we will add some sort of validation on install at
some point, and then we will be able to reduce the requirements. I do
understand your points - we've thought a lot about this.

--

Matthew Jones

Roy Lambert wrote:

>  Without logging in added one of each to the cart, closed IE and then
> reopened. Still there. Now to reboot, and its still there.

This is indeed the case. The cart is maintained "permanently" until you
finish. Lots of people will take a while to complete the order. I may
add an expiry but it would probably be 7 or 10 days.

--

Matthew Jones

Matthew

>It is expected that we will add some sort of validation on install at
>some point, and then we will be able to reduce the requirements. I do
>understand your points - we've thought a lot about this.

Colour me confused (no surprise there). I thought that was what this "We have people who bought the software ten years ago asking for install codes, and we happily give them again" meant.

Roy Lambert

Roy Lambert wrote:

> Matthew
>
> > It is expected that we will add some sort of validation on install
> > at some point, and then we will be able to reduce the requirements.
> > I do understand your points - we've thought a lot about this.
>
> Colour me confused (no surprise there). I thought that was what this
> "We have people who bought the software ten years ago asking for
> install codes, and we happily give them again" meant.

Our current process is all manual, so someone buys, they get a
temporary code, and we email them a permanent one. It's been that way
for 18 years... Thus if someone bought ages ago but doesn't have their
email with the details, we will send them again. But the software
doesn't check with any server or anything, and that could change. When
you install, it might talk to the server to validate it. And if we mark
the order as "bad", then it would not install (most likely in future,
rather than the first one of course). But that won't fit all customers,
so we will see.

--

Matthew Jones

Matthew

>This is indeed the case. The cart is maintained "permanently" until you
>finish. Lots of people will take a while to complete the order. I may
>add an expiry but it would probably be 7 or 10 days.

You have some seriously weird customers.

As the old saying goes - its not the way I'd design it - but its your bat and ball so WTF

Roy Lambert

Matthew


Final thoughts for you to keep in mind as you work on it. Why not has a "save order" button and store the details on your machine? To retrieve it the customer would have to log in first and would then be able to continue, or not bother and start a new order.

Its how a few sites I've used recently work.

Roy Lambert

Roy Lambert wrote:

> Matthew
>
> > This is indeed the case. The cart is maintained "permanently" until
> > you finish. Lots of people will take a while to complete the order.
> > I may add an expiry but it would probably be 7 or 10 days.
>
> You have some seriously weird customers.

8-) Well, how long do you think Amazon keep things in your cart on
their system? The answer is forever - you may come back in a month and
complete the order. Do nothing to get in the way of a customer buying
something I say!


--

Matthew Jones

Matthew

>> > This is indeed the case. The cart is maintained "permanently" until
>> > you finish. Lots of people will take a while to complete the order.
>> > I may add an expiry but it would probably be 7 or 10 days.
>>
>> You have some seriously weird customers.
>
>8-) Well, how long do you think Amazon keep things in your cart on
>their system? The answer is forever - you may come back in a month and
>complete the order.

Not in the same way you're doing. Go to Amazon.co.uk, do not logon, add a few items to the checkout, close the browser, reopen, go back to amazon - NO order. I'm not going to login just in case I get tempted

>Do nothing to get in the way of a customer buying
>something I say!

Ow ow - apart from mandating registration BEFORE getting their money <VBG>


Roy Lambert