Fons,

<< I never quite understand this. Why does the client want D7 over D2007 >>

I suspect this will really start to change when people want more
Vista-oriented applications.  At some point D7 is probably going to start to
have UI issues with these newer OS's.

--
Tim Young
Elevate Software
www.elevatesoft.com

Hi Tim,

> I suspect this will really start to change when people want more
> Vista-oriented applications.  At some point D7 is probably going to start
> to have UI issues with these newer OS's.

Yes, I agree. Eventhough I use Vista myself, my app looks like a Win98 app,
cause a flashy UI ain't important. The UI needs to be well arranged and
efficient and the app itself needs to be rock solid.

Still, I hope Johnnie can eleborate cause I can see why D2007 need to be
used over D7 (UI, OS and DB backends) but the otherway around just puzzles
me.

Best regards,
Fons

Johnnie,

<< Whoa, hold on. CodeGear has not said anything at all to this effect.
These are all my own words here. >>

BTW, the wasn't included to imply sarcasm.   These really are all my own
words.  CodeGear has been nothing but supportive and responsive since its
creation.  Much better than Borland, IMO.  They've still got some work to do
on the IDE front, but they are making good progress.

--
Tim Young
Elevate Software
www.elevatesoft.com

"Fons Neelen" <fons.neelen@xs4all.nl> wrote in message
news:E8B557E6-303F-415C-8701-0372055105A1@news.elevatesoft.com...
> Still, I hope Johnnie can eleborate cause I can see why D2007 need to be
> used over D7 (UI, OS and DB backends) but the otherway around just puzzles
> me.

They already own the compilers, tools, and libraries for Delphi 7. Upgrading
would be expensive for each coder and would require code changes as well,
which would be expensive. But I think the main reason they do not want to
upgrade is a huge uncertainty of stability, of D2007 and the company that is
behind it.

-Johnnie

Johnnie,

> They already own the compilers, tools, and libraries for Delphi 7.
> Upgrading would be expensive for each coder and would require code changes
> as well, which would be expensive. But I think the main reason they do not
> want to upgrade is a huge uncertainty of stability, of D2007 and the
> company that is behind it.

Ahhh, yes, that make sense. So your product is some sort of component - it
cannot be an end product. They are developers themselves. Thanks for the
info.

I would like CodeGear to be really independent of Borland. To me, they are
doing a good job of turning things in the right direction. And D2007 work
for me really well. But, it is easy for me and might be not so easy for them
to change to the new IDE. Still, as time progresses, at some point they
might be forced too...

Best regards,
Fons

Hi,

As a another CG partner and vendor and ElevateSoft integrator, I can say
that CG have not pressured us to do anything of such sorts.
However Im pretty sure we all are very aware about several important issues:

- We are for the most part dependant on the existance of CG. CG dont have to
tell us that, we know that.
- We do for the most part of us, spend quite too much time supporting older
versions of Delphi than we actually like. I personally fully understands
Tim's original choise, although I personally would probably keep D7 option
around for a bit longer than April 08.
- The majority of us would definitely not like to have to rewrite our code
to something else if we can avoid that at all costs.

Basically I stated it in this article from more than a year ago:
http://www.components4programmers.com/articles/thestoryof3rdpartyannouncementsa.htm

"Dont think... what can a vendor do for YOU. Think what YOU can do for the
vendor you have already chosen!"


--
best regards
Kim Madsen
kbm@components4developers.com
www.components4developers.com

www.myc4d.com - Your access to cool code
blogs.myc4d.com - Your access to code tidbits and comments

The best components for the best developers
Application server enabling technology for developers

"Johnnie Norsworthy" <jln206@verizon.net> skrev i en meddelelse
news:E0BD1E2D-3A5D-491B-9BBC-B11828A3407F@news.elevatesoft.com...
> "Tim Young [Elevate Software]" <timyoung@elevatesoft.com> wrote in message
> news:7B4B4FB5-BE50-4313-8A66-F28742CD897A@news.elevatesoft.com...
>> It's not just money right now.  It's the future of CodeGear and Elevate
>> Software that is at issue here.  We use their compilers to develop our
>> products, so if customers don't buy the CodeGear IDEs and they go away,
>> then we lose the ability to write any products in the future using their
>> compilers.  Thus we're screwed and are forced to port our entire product
>> line over to an entirely different compiler.  Put more exactly, without
>> RAD Studio 2007 we don't put out a .NET 2.0 data provider without porting
>> EDB entirely to Chrome or C#.  If CodeGear goes away, then we will be
>> forced to move entirely to another IDE/compiler and leave the Delphi
>> market behind, which I certainly do not want to do in any way, shape, or
>> form.  So, we can all sit around and relish the good 'ole days of Delphi
>> 7 and earlier, or we can move forward and keep supporting CodeGear in a
>> way that ultimately benefits us all.
>
> I knew it would come to this sooner or later with Delphi and codegear. I
> am asssuming that CG made this apparent to their tech partners in the last
> few months. But this is the first mention I have seen from a third-party
> vendor. I guess pressuring partners to sell for them is easier than
> selling it themselves (sorry, that was a jab a CG)
>
> There must be a better way for CG to promote Delphi - like maybe spending
> something on marketing. The product sure isn't anywhere I look in
> programming literature these days. And of course the buzz lately from CG
> is "we're doing the best we can".
>
> If someone paid me to work in D2007 I would do it, but the clients I have
> all want D7 or Visual Studio. If I could pick my preferred language, it
> would be Chrome. I love it.
>
> Good luck in your future endeavors. I hope Delphi succeeds in spite of the
> company behind it. It always has before.
>
> -Johnnie
>
>

> Or are you referring to doing so in code ?

Yep.


> If so, then you may want to look

That's the problem. I don't have the time. It's a lost feature for me.
I spent a great deal of time writing code based on that, I have a bunch
of apps using it. Dunno when I'll have spare time to reinvent the
sliced bread.


regards,
Lucian

> reason they do not want to upgrade is a huge uncertainty of
> stability, of D2007 and the company that is behind it.

So, some of them (those who pay you) *are* indeed programmers,
otherwise how would they know anything about stability of D7, let alone
D2007?

And come on ... "huge instability"? It's really not that bad, unless
you can't afford 1 GB RAM (and a pretty decent machine I guess)


Lucian

> I suspect this will really start to change when people want more
> Vista-oriented applications.  At some point D7 is probably going to
> start to have UI issues with these newer OS's.

Not necessarily:

http://www.installationexcellence.com/articles/VistaWithDelphi/Original/
Index.html

http://www.installationexcellence.com/articles/VistaWithDelphi/Index.htm
l

This is much more common now on large Linux/Unix systems. In fact,
quite a few of the virtual server systems offered these days are used
to "divide and conquer" large builds, and not tie up any in-house
hardware.